would be. thank you all for being with us. u:ow to your comes. obama wins either way, he wins if negottion go his way or if we go or the fiscal cliff, either way, america loses. not so fast, i think we have choices. that is it for us, thank you, we'll see you tomorrow night goodight from new york. neil: think fat cats are still angry at the president? t chance, what if i told you a lot of sucking up to the talk abo off the wall or ould i say off the wall street, welcome neil cavuto here, and charlie gparino had it right, there is no squirmier, bunch than those on wall street. they were throwing any money they had to make sure that barack obama would be a one

term, but now all but core coreon core -- cronning him all some with betwnmperor a king. a growiumr of financial types figuring nowhat the president is in, best both ses sort things by caving in. on everything from higher taxes r t rich, that is fine. higher investment related taxes onveryone, have at it. more stimulus, why not why this folding like a cheap suit now? maybe because the financial suits figure to go along so just getlong. i think at electns have consequences, i did not think th wall street so quickly selling its financial soul was one of it in other words, if you hateomeone, stick with it!

that's all i'maying, charlie gasparino, liberal columnnist, -- he goes by progressive. rick you thinker. unger is here with us, and charley you first, you called it you saw it but a leap of skill on your part to conclude these3 guys are dise dis disingenuous . >> you are talking about all my sources,. neil: but you were spot on. >> deputy to llary clinton, former morgan stanley executives trying to be obama's chief of staff. and tom knight has been making the rounds on wall street having dinners with various wall street

streetictives. -- executives. and he setting the stage for an interesting wall street embrace of the president. you listen to these guys, ceo of goldman sachs, goes up tre before the water, he looks like he has within water tortured minutes before, eyes shiftg. neil: i don't know he was waterer to thetured. i think that guy,hoer? lead, and whoever is the winner. things he opposed, long col on, just weeks ago, now sign me up. >> what is ridiculous, he went out and said we need to cut expenditures and a planned approach but tn he said, president has a creble plan ta raise a lot of taxes. >> ihink they are allll pathetic

losers, they make washington, d.c. look lik choir boys, i am shocked. in record time, turning to this guy who cald him every name in the boo dirty rotten scoundrels of wall street, n ey are playing ft ftse i is grossndreepy. neil: i did not think that losing your backbone was one of them. >> i am becoming comfortable here, this week charlie calling out wa street, good job, last week you hung a hamme and is a sickle on dee-dee. >> did. neil: do you find it odd that wall street that opposed him on every single pha of his agenda. >> not every phase. neil please. >> now, y hav to beepulled

by that. >> i am pleased by their decision it ishat it is. neil: no, i think we have discussed this elections and i know we set againstaising taxes but,f that is the consequence of election for a presidt w campaigned hikin on the back of the rich, i don't like it but, to fold. >> this is a hypocrisy level, thee say this is the right thing too, but who gets crushed on the higher taxes? small businesses. i don't care what anyone said, presidentaid that 97% o small businesses do not get hit by this, that is if youount the guy int mows your lawn all by himself, and consultants, but those who are hiring --

>> i don blame the presint at all,o ram it down the people's throat. >> we need though -- -- >> myear is that wall stree acquiesce it kws we'll have far reaching problem. >>of course, like money managers all of a sudden, they e the king, they are self preservation is sad. neil: what are they afraid of? >> they want to keep their money, they want to be the mack daddy. we neehe cut and flash s.w.a.t. team,,cutting across the board. >> that is an interesting question, what are they afraid of. theresident has a good hand th do not believe- >> a good hd not aeally good nd. >> i tell you what they think, they think that president has a better hand than he probably has. >> that is not areat hand. >> but a good hand, they have a

that if you put it together, and that replicans they can force the republicans to cave the will not be a fiscal cliff that will be damagin. neil: i tell you, better no deal than the deal they are comin up with right now. i raise with you othis, fair and balanced abo ts wh president bush, he read that relatively clolection with john kerry as a mandate to do all sorts of things, and mandate of the not there i think it was a cas of overreach now, and his president is overreaching now,ifference now is that you have a whole powerful section of the economy, going to along for this ridiculous ride. >> you have to be careful, correct thaidon't think that hat president has ishe result of a huge electoral victory, it was od but not huge, where the hand comesrom is knowing the american people how they feel with respect to increases in taxes butqually as iortant. is how the cuts end upcoming wn, there areoioing to be

cuts,ne other thing, charley. neil: do you think thereill be spending cuts ? >> definitely. it is going to happen. it --- it will be historic. il: not partf this deal. >> it will b historic. >> it will happen. neil: opening ga openi gam bet x hikes. >> not hpening. neil: really. >> think about how student this is -- stupid this is, there is no need to raise taxes, you don't get enough money, there is no bang for the buc neil: it is going to happen, this is stupid, i know where you are going. time tlet g. somebody needs a hug. >> give charlie a ug. >> oh, charlie. neil: i'm not making a statement i'm telng you, this is going to happen.

i'm not a fan of -- i'm worried though, again to rick a point, notwithstanding we'll not see the cuts, not inhe balance -- we have to see the cut >> it will defy -- >> you know walltreet should not have caved so ear. wall street ebled this proble then -- >> when washe last time, we had al, where you rse %-be cuts that cutsappened. to >> never. >> i will agree. >> the republican -- >> you are going to see ces in medicar n necessarilysee changes tha republicans -- >> don't believe that, how about obamacare. >> you mightee - >> come on! >> tiny. are you kdi me? >> i tell you, if it goes the way i fear it might be, better no deal than a bad deal. either way, credit rating anxiies will pouncagencyll pouna

ponderosa buffet. is not going to be pretty. be prepared for a fiscal cliff, a bad deal -- none of those guys on the republican side -- >> i think look bac at your besellers have a tinge of guilt tat road you to publishe publishing fame a wel lusivers n pin stripes. >> ty are good guys. >> you called them worms. >> they are good guy worms. >> i hate you >>ll right. >> i love you all. neil: i wish we had more time. anyuts are dead on arrival,

he'll beere, so is ralph nader nader. lashing back about how u.s. coanies are taking money out, wait until you hear him let her rip. >> but first the democrat who demanded a voioice and g one, demanded a voioice and g one, did h before copd...

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i got my firs prescption free. or click to learn more. [ me announcer ] if you can't afford your medicatio astrazeneca may be able to help. >> we came apart to make sure at voice and iss we face at governors in the states are heard and considered as part of discussis i washington, present was ope to that. said we would continue to have a seat at theable. neil: you know, that eression, a seat at table. you got one, so, you know calm down. ise is do you have any influence what you speak from that seat at that table? speaking with the governor,

governor do you think we'll >> i don't know.? the predent today was very focussed on wants to get to a solution. he did not handicap it for us, but you can tell he wants to get it done, he sees dage in terms of the economy in tms of the taxes goi up. neil: do you think he is over playing his han by that, f we were talking about 800 billion in tax hikes now said 1.6 tllion. has not detailed in way of spending cuts. sohere --on't republins have a gripe that he is kind of skewed in favor of taxes, taxes, taxes? >> i'm not going to play a pun it hire, oururpose in coming

to washington a group of three democrats and three republican governorso make sure tt perspective of the governors is heard. we you know meeti wh the president day was very productive. he -- >> how? how it was productiv what did he agree to? >> look, we didn't come to support his plan or the republican plan. i think -- >> why did the come? why? >> we came because as these convsations are going on. we want to makeure that perspeive the governors is heard, the fact that states are partners with federal gernment across a whole range of programs, and answer is not just a shift of cost to state, you don't -- just because you move mone off feder budget does notean you are saf figure money is picked up by the state. we talk about importance of flexibility in terms of some state programs. and president was on to that. neil: you run one o the most i

guess for lack of a better term, one of the more incorporated states, se -- s many coporations t up sho in the business friendlyelaware, they lot are nervous, about what is going on in washington, they feel they are running into brick wall. having their interest met or addresse i think that anxiety about lack of certainty is what is driving the president to want to get something done. he recognized when there is clarity it is mor likely they wi expand, and invest and hire and the like. neil: but clarity notwithstanding, you raise dividend related taxes, capital gains taxes, leaving aside the taxe on upper income. you areoing to do sustainable damage. that is what many of tteme fear, they fear that messa is not

get across. that a bad deal -- could be worse than n deal, if it is so constructed alo taxes, taxes, taxes. >> nobody wants a bad dea at theesame time, as i read some comments from business leaders wh have been in wasngton the st couple of weeks, they would like a plann approach. neil: what i is a balanced approacho you. >> i'm not going to get into that. neil no is it dollar for dollar or ratio. in both parties to wor out. and adminisation. neil: then why go to the white house? ratio used to be 3 to 1, and that is $3 in spending cuts for

every $1 in hes, now just the opposite, n it is dolrs 3 in tax hike f a highway patrol for $1forfor hope for $1 in speg cuts. >> why go to the white house. neil: concerns about the fiscal implication what it could mine for state budget. d secondly, the iact on our econom and. neil: you fear even if is not a grat deal, the risk of no deal, and recessiary risks are so eat, thatrumps a. >> certainly, if middle class taxes go up, that is not good for those taxpayers, or for any ofur economyy that is critical, i think again, certainty for business community so they can invest i in and high ser also important. >> tnk you governor.

>> all right. neil. neilopen me night at chuckles combs comedy club, republicans and democrats laughing at each other's offer laughing at each other's offer and countertwins. i di't see th. i have obligations. cu obligations, but obligatio. i ne to rethink the core omy portfolio. what i really need is sleep. i ne to rethink the introducing the isharecore, building blocks for the heart of youportfolio. find out why 9 out of 10 large professional invtors choose ishares for their etfs. ishareby blackrock. call 1-800-ishares for a prospectus which includes investment objectives, risks, charges and expenses. read and consider it carefully before invting. risk includes possible loss of principal. - ♪ america! ♪ america! - god shed his grace on thee ♪ - ♪ on th

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>> two times in the front, and twoo times in the back. >> all right. >> neil: one of my favorite things on tape remember that guy? he has companyn washington as nobody wants their junk touched. big unions say the same, pat

buchanan said it is hard to cut a deal, hen no one is cutting budget or slowing growth. that is reality. ratio now. 3 to 1 in favorf tax hikes over spendingut that is a best case scenario right now. >> well, the -- i remember ron aronald reaga in1985, he said they promised me $3 in spending cuts for every one i spending cuts, they gav him opposite he felt he had been taken to the cleaners in the bill, in 1982, that was on his mind for the rest of his presidency, and republicans are headed into the same trap. nei: i think, there are a lot of people who don't like tax hikes, but president campaigned to hiking taxes on the weahy,

as mh as i'm against it, it is going to happen. but if that a consequence, it is not, other consequence should not be you republicans losing your backbone and resolve on issues near toou, bu they are folding onheapuits on ooe issue after another, whatives? >> i think they realize, they have a gun to tir head, they are told by the preside, either y will give me an increase in tax rates, repeals bush tax cuts from 39 to 45%, and if you don't, i will sit here, and we'll go ove the cliff, and everybody's taxes will be raise. i think president obama is less frigened of going over the cliff tha the republicans are, that is why the republicans are making all concessioos. i tell you, if we go over the cliff, here is what he wouldo,

sa okay, now, everyone's tax have been raised, it happened because the republicans wanted stand by their fat cat friends, while i tell you, what their taxes will stay where they are increased and i have a tax cut f 98% of aricans that will send up to the hill a seen as congress gets back here, we restore the bush tax cuts for middle class and workin work cst the rich are paying their fair share, and i think that country will applaud. neil: you think he comes out a hero, that is why republicans fear if that scenario they lose. >> they are i a lose-se situatio onl thing obama has to fear is, if he plays it hardball, and takes us over tha@ cliff,n play the savior beyond the cliff. its possible that we could have a real downturn, a real recessn. and a real problem in the economy,nhich case, barac

obama will not escape the historic reputation of the democrats' herbert hoover. neil no president inves a recession on his watch, assuming that is what happens if you get to this cliff. that is what happens. so, he must know, thehite house must know, the predent must know that is a very big gamble. >> it is. he realizes he is move immediately to restore tax cuts to 98%, secondly, he is not withou pressure. he has his you mentioned them the black caucus, unions, liberals areesaying, look we didn't win this elect too gut the programs medicare, and medicaid and social security, obamacare. >> you are right. there is zero appetite for that. but here is what worries me. i hope i am misreading polls and

numbers, a lot saying go after the rich. very little appetite for addressing spending. i wonder whether the country is shifted to -- yeah we like government, the more the better, shut up. >> you areargely correct. the point is, weave 48 or 49% of country getting direct benefits from government, and8 or 49% paying no tes. think of the republican constituents, a lot are seniors, they depend on social security some medicare, and republicans saying we'll give you tax incrses and shave back social seccrity and shave backk medicare. to what constituency are they appealing?

a couple making a hundred thousand a year, 2,000-dollars ght off th top, a huge share of theiriscretionary income, republican party will have t go back to the drawing board, and decide who and what it is, and whom it reprents. neil: i have to get -- the a backbone first. >> thank you, patrick. >> thank you. neil: taxes areo high here that companies stash cash everywhere but here, ralph nader on the money drain that is causing us a lot of pain. want to try to crack it? yeah, that'she way to do it!

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>> many comnies are ting to take their money and run huge firms. ralph nader a big critic of many corporations and a move like is, ralph, what do you think? this is n a shock given what they are fing? >> this has been going on for a lo time, with transfer pricing they stash cashverseas, sometimes in countries with significant tax rates they can deduct if they bridg bring the y back home, a lot of times in the hamas-type tax haven. there is nothing new about that. and they stash far more cash

overse..3 >> that is another sry. they raisi dividends to beat the tax man. but i willay, money chases the cheapest mket, and i think now, taxes are getti to poit here, of that they will be highist of the industrialized rld, so corporations. they done gettthose mbas for collg books - colors books. >> let me put it thisay, explanation in this book. if you read this book. neil: no one sells their book better. >> the neil spiel will go sky skyward with looms onty. >> the intend offer to to keep cashbroad is to avoid the -- to invtbroad, you know they are expanding in markets they need money.

neil: there is nothing wrong with that. >> it is really, to escape america, because. if thehave 50% of their profit hi, they have 80% cash overseas. so it is disproportional and a matter of patriotism. neil: i will say by your reckoning, a starbucks, a thrives success on ery other block in u.s., when it branches out tongland- whe they want to tax them to hell by the way -- is that wro? >> no. main thing is, where they abandon theiromtment here, this is where they get r&d, this is where they rose torofits, this iss where they were born, this is where their communies

are. neil: we tral all over the worl i love america when i do. but i like travelling, these companies,xpand, they open up new markets. they like their home bas tha providedmpetus for them to could pand. >> if they over dot if they stack their expenses in u.s., andut a higr proportion abroad. neil: do you not think we're chasinghemway, why not be patriotic while w screw you on the wall. >> these are just taxavens. ne: i know tha that. if you or pick out a haven it is beautiful. my point, on this, look. these areore of the exception

than will rule, a lot have most of their people here, inhis environmen there is little reason to lock at promising u.s., what is attracting money to pces like switzerland, that its n, inhibiting capital forming a and grrwth, we are. this has been developinnnder republicans and democratic esidents alike with rules and regulations this is a very unfriendly eironment to business. >> tax -- real tax rate for the large corporations, many who pay no federal income tax is 17%, i is not 35% or 30%,hat is the ta rate, due to all loopholes. neil: i know, we canet into this argument. the real taxate in japan now north of 13%, we can go back and forth on this t trend is up here, there are a lot o countries where reversing or slowing there, that is to a

businessman looking to expand a good reason to expand. >> let lower the bar, let's expect these u.s c corporations3 with their privilages they have been given, as least keep as much money her as percentage -- >> you act like they are dng nothg her they are hiring people, and growing hire, they have done a well the here, and our thank you to them. >> as we talked before, neil, theyave -- they a sitting on $2 trilln in cas nonfinancial cporation like general electric. give it back to dividend owners, give it more -- they will spend more money. neil: then they will raise will beed. >> let's put it this way. a lot of tes irs cannot find out what is gong on due on

transfer pricing. transf pricing can be illegal. they don't h enough auditors to cover the sprawling global corporatio, your own fox news, made it clear i somhing that i look d today, that there is a far highe cash horde abroad than is reflected in terms of the profits here, and abroad, for big company like sysco, like emc and even apple. neil: they have bn moving up with prospects of rates going up, i don't think this is rocket science. >>et's open this up, best way to deal with this fiscal cliff, get revenues on tngs we don't like, like, wall street speculation tax, and tax gets rid of corporate welfare, and put it no community public -- put it into community public work renovatio that creates jobs that cannot be exported to china, it is amazing that

congress does not get that connection. at leastut it back into the@ community. thats the best way -- >> ralph. i ve youo much, b i wish i had more time to just yell at you. i want to get you bac continued success wh your book. >> thank you, neil. neil: when we come bark, text, you tex people, it is 20 years old today, what should i wear? ♪ ♪ [ engine revs ] ♪ [ me announcer ] oh what fun it is to ride.

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neil: text at 20. that is right text-message is 20 years old this wee but it might be celebrating in a difffferentell it year, law enforcement groups are pushing

to have your text lked up for two years, they need to build a case in caseou comt a crime later. where is all this texting going? is there a ctralal text building or -- where is thhs? >> no, when you send a text, it depends on who your mobile carrier is, whether or not it ts saved and for how long, that is handled byompany that you, deal with, that you subscribe to. what law enforcementments to for all ofhose companies each and every one of them to be required to store probablyn a ctrally mandated rularized way, store all of your texts, youend to your familyembers, colleagues, whoer. they want thoseompanies to be requed neil: sounds outrageous that outrageous.

there is a cnce one one out of a billion people is a criminal, come on. >> that ist this is a blanket requiremen of all of the texts only a small fractionre going to be criminals. w enforceme wants to keep it, consider this las year law enforcemen made 1.3 million requests for user data from mobile compani. neil: when you make 1.3 million questions for user data on individuals? >> that is more than that, some requests were for cell ter data, so say anyone whoas connected to a cell tower,

during a piod of time, anyon o in that area, so any calls any information might have turned up, you cannot find out if you were o ofhose people, millions of people, he had their mobile data trackedooked at by law enforcement. >>hat is creepy. i would recommend punishment for way some texts are written. gram aticly smelling, but i see, what kind o society we live in where authorities hang on this stuff, whos reading it, text i sense to my boss my wife or iend that was efficient them, not for some oth goofball to be pa ruing. because eif it never gets out they have no business lookingt it. neil: i bet they are not even asking, i bet they are getti

it of their own volition and accord and unstopped. >> previous versions of this had revion with law enforcemento look at e-mails without a warrant. wh they want to have z much data as they can get on yound or anye regardless if you are already a criminal,hey would like access to that any time. thing this isust in case we need it. that beces any time we want it. neil: thank you very much peter. >> thank you. ne: what is thatike, early russia? all right when we come back, you know surest sign companies are worried about falng off a cliff, which t do what they have done doing, in last few wes in record numbers. recordumbers.

neil: i case you have any doubt we're heading to a storm. carnival views cruise le hikes their dividend, andoach, the bag company doing the same. ahead of the big tax hike coming january 1st, we have david joing you, and sandra smith joining us, sandra, seone is worried abo something. >> you could say that, but the markets to me don't seem tt worried, s00 up 12%, and nazdaq up5%. neil: why are they raising their didend? >> that is the thing to doo avoid taxes, you c use costco, outrageous, they were a big fan

of democratic party, and sayg that w need to share the prlem. but here, here is how we'll share the problem, we'll tak a special divend, before the end of the year, and avoid these taxes we' not going to pay our fair share. acally borrowed that money, a lotf companies had this cash horde they hav been sitting on and it thoughto b a good thing they get it on system, but costco borrowe mey to pay out dividends thi year, before taxing go up next year, lot of the peopl as you menoned supportersf the democratic party, saying at ricneed it pay re, well, they borrow y instituture to pay today's -- in the future to p today's taxes. neil: they will pay more anyway, i understand to take from peter that was planned for paul now. and veryon is going to get screwed. >> the debt will be for next

year. neil: understood. >> they get cash, they can char the cash. neil: but fornvestors, it is a zero sum game, you will pay more in dividend taxes. taxes. >> everyone is paying more. and that i i just got off phe, i have been talkingith a private wealth manager, his phone has been ringing off the hook. neil: you can talk to private wealth managers. >> i have access. neil: dave and i talk with the dell i gudeli guy down the block >>t was fascinati, he says they are trim you thin trimmine stock perspectives, taking them out of commodity. one said they are trimming them down by a third. neil: what does that mean. >> stock, overall allocation in

custer portfolio. il: to what? >> bonds or cash, that is last thing that the market needs rightow. neil: dad. >> the one thing we all have to remember, a keep this in your memory bank we'llearga, maybe twoea or tee years from now people like warr buffet saying, tax increasing or decreases do not affect my, strategy. look at what shaping now, they are chaed all over as a result ofaxes going up, yes, they do, strategies dependn whether you pay more pore l or less inn tax. ne: we could remember, wel she was not born, all fears about clinton taxike, it would lead to,evere recession, now, i know he mixed it with other goodies toounter the blow but he had a boom. >> we d not have a boom uutil lf way through.

taxes witness up in 1993. neil: my point is, it wasot financial armeddon. what if wre wrong? >> it has been pven time again, 28% t 20%, weaw revenue doue from that capital gain income to government, so it worked then, 1980, ron reagan did it. >> you are not addressin ending. reality. spending.on iddress >> wre not, january 1st,we havef debt, the conversation is not about cs spending that is where it should be. neil: 3 to 1 i favorf tax hikes overrpending cuts. >>he stimulus, that began in 2009, it never stopped. we go the to 2010, 2011, 2012 it

adds up close to where our deficit is. neil: a very good pnt. i wish we had more time. b s little time. more after ts. i ierrupt, you interrupt, and i ierrupt, you interrupt, and then you sende all sorts of you know how painful hearn can be. for fast, long lasting relief, use doctor recommended gaviscon®. only gaviscon® forms a protective barrier that helps blocktomach acid from splashing up- relievinghe pain quickly. t fast, long lasting gaviscon®.

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>> rememr the-mails abouttmy interruptions? i read it through of flurry of commons that interru y too much. that dot dozens of peopl fired . for thospeople w rate the mean matte are not. >> i love you bled if interrupting people was money would be a millionaire. >> how couldnybody